. >> what i'm wondering with all of this, is this all just technology. is this all stuff that has been happening for thousands of years and it's just because we have e-mail records -- >> i think it is. >> i mean, maybe this is not amazing at all. maybe it's just the electronic paper trail. >> should we still be forcing out top leaders like david petraeus for sexual shenanigans? >> we can just decide not to. that's the thing that's so odd about this. all the blackmail issue, he could be blackmailed by this, if we just said we won't punish people for this, all the blackmail threats go away. i just think that human beings really like sex. i think that's all that's really showing. >> rick, would you go along with that? >> well, well, you know, our european counterparts laugh at us when they see that we do this to ourselves. they say well, you're removing a four star general because he had an affair. we say yes and they say why. as long as it doesn't -- >> in france it would be almost compulsory. >> a lot of americans laugh, too. not just europeans. a lot of